5.0 Experimental is out

HWS General Discussion
21

I was waiting for let not a revolution but at least some fresh air. The game needs more consistency, more different functional modules. And all these textures and models to draw the armistice. Made strong and stable core of the game and then paint.

Plus: Faction alliances (but it is minus too - we have only groups of bulls now it is be the herd)
Weapons range fix!
Fixed splash damage (if it work in mp)
Hangar doors 5x7 !!!

And it all for me.

22

I skyped + sceen shared with the devs and showed it to them. Fix is coming soon.

We discussed about target prioritization. Turrets were an idea but since you can sneaky build them and while moving it would be silly to hit we set it to the core for now.
Other suggestions?

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23

There is a great deal of discussion about turret targeting in this thread: http://empyriononline.com/threads/cv-combat-test-with-surprise-ending-possibility-to-make-stealth-ship-npc-aiming-priorities.7584/

Highlights are:
-Turrets targeting the device on the defending ship that is closest to the attacking ship
-Missiles tracking engines rather than center of ship

A dirty solution that might be easier to implement would be turrets targeting a random block on the ship. Not ideal but would be a far sight better than what we have now. Targeting core would also be a passable solution.

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24

Be able to “program” turrets prioritytargets, like Core, turrets, engines and so on in specific priority the player choose?

25
  • Core targeting doesn’t work (open for abuse). At least it’s better than center targeting. At least the turrets and missiles will always work and you can’t cheese aliens anymore with ‘godmode’… Oh wait you can…
  • Center targeting doesn’t work (open for exploit).
  • Turret targeting won’t work (also open for abuse as you already mentioned).
  • Random block targeting is meh. Fights would rely too much on RNG.
  • Component targeting I assume drains too much server performance?
  • Active cockpit targeting? Nope also open for abuse (respawn in another using many medbays/cockpits) but less open to abuse than most options.
  • Engine targeting also open for abuse.
  • Targetting the closest device is also open for abuse (same problem as turret targeting basically only worse) in 1vs1 fights. Perhaps in large scale battle that this would work.

So what’s left…

[quote=“Loke, post:24, topic:2733, full:true”]
Be able to “program” turrets prioritytargets, like Core, turrets, engines and so on in specific priority the player choose?
[/quote]This would be ideal but, probably not doable at such a short notice. Takes a lot of time to implement. But yes if I could program or assign priorities to my own turrets… That would be ideal.

My conclusion: I have no short-term quick-fix solution :frowning:

26

+1 …

27

I’ll make a large number of small armored boxes (hard to hit) in front of my ship with a random device in it. I also add many dummy engines that are turned off in very annoying places.

Then I move all critical components 100 blocks behind it or something while having a legion of dummy blocks and put my turrets and guns away from it for sure.

In a game where we can build ships to counter almost everything, making a good AI is very hard and complex. Therefor the ideal solution is to let the players chose it for themselves. But this like I said may not be doable within a weeks time. Considering that. IF I would have to vote, I agree with Alex/Xanif. But the cheese ships will come I guarantee it.

28

Please elaborate on this. Targeting components on the ship is, in my opinion, the best way to go about turret targeting. I fail to see how turrets shooting at important bits is “open to abuse.”

Edit: Hold on, just saw your response. Let me read it.

Edit 2: I fail to see how this is abuse. Creating dummy components, especially with device count in 5.0, is a calculate tradeoff in ship design. Having “decoy” systems would still be devices that can be destroyed.

29

Ah wait… The guns could be a target. You always want them to remain intact during battle. But after they are destroyed we need a 2nd target for the turrets. Hard to cheese those.

30

btw, 1st results of our faction tests - dmg still go through armor. Its gg.

1 Like
31

Maybe I gotta think from the attacker perspective:

  • I want my artillery turrets to fire at the largest area (so that the chance of missing is the smallest and the damage the biggest).
  • I want my miniguns and cannon turrets to shoot enemy turrets/guns
  • I want my plasma to aim for enemy devices hoping for a lucky lagshot or noob-build.
  • Etc… Basically I want different targets for each turret.

[quote=“AlexAKM, post:30, topic:2733, full:true”]
btw, 1st results of our faction tests - dmg still go through armor. Its gg.
[/quote]… Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo… Don’t tell me this when we have a 20k block limit please… :sob: So basically ALL PVP bugs from 4.0 are in 5.0…

32

I mean, lag shots are irritating but are not a huge concern of mine. Using half blocks instead of full blocks on the interior of your ship has the same effect as having empty spaces but still gives you the armor value. It’s an annoying bug but it’s not a core design feature unlike turret targeting.

33

Yeah but the problem with those blocks is that I often glitch out (other bugs… yup) and my character gets stuck in those spaces :stuck_out_tongue: . Ask Jasscha he had to help me out from those spots quite a bit lately. On top of that it causes a lot of extra FPS drain and is annoying to build/repair.

Without the blocklimit I can counter everything. With the blocklimit I can maybe counter everything again. But the targeting is a really big problem and I have no perfect solution :frowning:

This is 4.0:

  • lag shots penetrating x layers of armor
  • aoe shots going through armor (up to 6 at least)
  • faction ships not shooting at private ships (fixed now I believe)
  • turrets&AI&homing not shooting if there is nothing at the center
  • weird physics/flight controls on planets
  • inside-out shooting
  • and more

This is 5.0:

  • EXACTLY THE SAME… Okay aside from the faction vs private bug perhaps, if that is fixed.

[quote=“Xanif, post:34, topic:2733”]
I get stuck in my ship all the time.
[/quote]At least I’m not alone… But one workaround for bug x causes problems with bug y… I hate it…

[quote=“RexXxuS, post:35, topic:2733”]
I don’t think player will choose in a battle?!
[/quote]Choose before battle :wink: I’d probably make a generic setup for my turrets that will counter most ships. And if a ship appears that counters my turrets I retreat, adjust turrets, come back.

34

I get stuck in my ship all the time. It’s really irritating and why I always have a multitool on me. But it’s a bug which is understandably hard to fix unlike turret targeting which is a core game concept that should be actively investigated for balancing.

35

Hm I see. It can go to an open discussion. Let player choose is handy but would take some work and overall maybe too complex to the players. I don’t think player will choose in a battle?!
-> sees a ships… -> analyze his weak spots -> switching the target mode -> … dead

Currently it needs more balance overall. CVs are for me like SVs on steroids. I would personally prefer CVs = slow big motherships. SVs = hornets. Alone weak but in mass deadly.

But yeah, first tackle some bugs.

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36

Send me the video of it please how you are testing this on an Experimental branch. Otherwise your post is gg.

37

/off-topic Btw, this forum is weird, I made a post and the forum put it ABOVE your posts even though my post time is later :stuck_out_tongue: Forum bug or intended?

38

Intended since you hugging the edit button all the time. If you wanna have a new post timestamp then click reply :stuck_out_tongue:

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39

Why not config it in turret options??? Like we conig it now for attacking npc.

40

Really the best way would be turrets shoot at mouse cursor…

But I don’t think we are getting that anytime soon.

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