Empyrion Education: Splash feat. Lagshot

HWS General Discussion
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Hello guyz, I’m still exist :slight_smile: Was through covid, pneumonia, hospital stuff, etc… but I’m totally fine now :slight_smile:
So, let’s watch a video and discuss after.
Little announce, its all might be new or interesting for new players, PvE players and similar guys. PvP veterans know this information for years already.

As you might now @Politary made a fake issue report and sold Rex a dummy on git: https://github.com/B-iggy/HWS-Configs/issues/2
“Also it seems that high projectile speed makes lagshots more common” - after this video you should understand it was a lie (or Poly is just PvE noob still, lol), lagshot is only possible with direct fire weapons like mounted pulse laser. Their company just wanted to use Nasral’s spinning propeller bs to evade all poorly guided homing projectiles. Hope this story ends with current HWS season and we will get better PvP cfg next season.

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Here you can see clearly - mounted pulse lasers destroying fuel tanks through 20+ blocks on piloted moving vessel. Maybe devs finally admit the existence of a lagshot?.. Nah, game is released, all bugs are fixed…

Look here now: https://github.com/B-iggy/HWS-Configs/commit/6a918013711f09211e5d7c54a68cf29a6b8aef7b

please checkout this branch only to test what a player said: “higher projectile cause lagshots”

I hope now everyone, include @RexXxuS, should understand that “higher projectile cause lagshots” is complete BS. I told Rex earlier, I’m talking now. Maybe its time to listen to me… but who knows? :slight_smile:

Why even talk about it? Cause I and the majority of PvP community want good old config back. I mean, not everything, but roll back some EWS values.

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Some time ago I send Rex a message and he completely ignored it. Well, time to make another try, more public. So, my wishes on HWS 14 EWS:

  1. Return speeds of projectiles as they were in 12, 11, 10 and etc seasons. Projectiles make splash damage, not lagshots.
  2. Return the ability to snipe CV turrets. That means roll back CV Pulse Laser to “Effective” against “Metal” group devices. Cause now you need like 10-20 direct hits to destroy single CV turret.
  3. Same thing about HV Artillery Turret, most powerful HV weapon need like 5+ (or even more, don’t remember) shots to destroy single BA turret.
  4. Shields… they are still completely broken as you know what. They spoil PvP gameplay a lot. I would like to disable them completely for PvP, but its barely possible I guess, so I wish they will be nerfed as hard as possible (regeneration rate and overall HP value). New feature with plasma alternative fire is nice, but, for example, BA’s shield start regenerate faster, than you reload your anti-shield plasma, which is ridiculous.

I think these are main problems and its a good time to highlight it just before new season. Also NY and Christmas coming, who knows, maybe magic is possible and we will get good balanced PvP cfg :laughing:

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over the past 2 years in HWS i have heard this plight many times. “season x was better.” and “we should go back to…” sad truth is the developers have changed so much it is impossible to “go back” without reverting to that specific version number. alas though no matter what changes are made, there have ALWAYS been complaints of one thing or another. with each season i have yet to hear much positive input other than “season x was much better” but i remember hearing nothing but complaints during those “golden times”

in short, this is ever evolving and changing so we can only offer feedback and hope the unreachable goal of balance will be reached one day…

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Well done. Looking forward to a response from the HWS team. Hopefully they can bring this to the attention of the Devs.

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Season 13 was awful if speak about PvP balance. I always evade PvE content in my topics of this type, cause its all another story. HWS 13 EWS cfg almost killed my interest in Empyrion, it was more effective than my 7 bans here (maybe it was the plan? :rofl:)
Also I didn’t evaluate past seasons, I just say some current EWS values is really bad, need a fix and previous were better.
So its different.

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there are soo many things wrong with this server. example, config is whack, pve players are catered to way too much, crying to admins is now seen as a “pvp” tactic, etc, etc, etc.
which is why i uninstalled this game to begin with.

i proved my point as one of the best sv pilots in the game, enemies didnt like it so they cried to rex about it. i got tired of all this crying and false claims of me having an aim bot.
GG to all those who fell victim to me!
Maybe, just maybe, i might come back next season. maybe…

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lol season 13 had more issues than most :wink: but yes i see where ur coming from. perhaps the configs can be updated throughout the season rather than waiting until a new one. i feel it would help find that balance we have been searching for…

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yes we need u churro. someone has to keep people on their toes :wink:

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Yeah churro definitely doesn’t have an aim bot , he is a bot theres a difference. but the point made about x y or z season being better is true…

they’ve focused on the pve lets players and left PvP community to rot. starting a long time ago around the end of Alpha 9, where I and most players left the game for many reasons, one being pvp cfg change so much… I dont know why anyone would say fast projectile = lag shot…

we know for many years that Manual Lasers are the biggest offenders of lag shot… they can fire through 4layers of hardened steel destroying only cockpit/some internals… its very frustrating and we’ve brought it to the attention of Eleon many times…

I think this is why its gotten so bad now, we tried many times to bring it to attention and seemingly nothing has been done about it, though many have brought it to light that there desperately needs to be a fix, a workaround or something…

but this post is a good start I suppose to bring attention to it , thanks @IceDrugg

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Season 5 was best season. Even with all the lag the massive battles produced, nothing but good times for everyone involved.

Since the introduction of triangle limits, CPU limits, shields, aggressive class limits, etc. it’s had a slow and steady decline.

I’m not saying it’s at HWS at fault, seemed more like at the primary developers trying to get more performance by limiting the options of the player base, instead of focusing more on optimizations to improve the gameplay.

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Season 5 is where the PVP changes started going to *&%$, and I agree the PVP community is mostly left to rot, well said PJams and NotOp. Bob regardless of what Elon does, Rexx changes a lot in the config, so thats a moot point bro. Ice is dead on with everything he’s voiced, and I appreciate him having the nuts to call out the powers that be. @IceDrugg never stops short! Love it bro! Taco…you’re spot on as well man…

And no HWS isnt at fault, its a dev shortcut just like you said. If they utilize the limits they can call it “fixed” and move on to breaking more features.

Wanna bet that if the PVE fanboys brought ANY ONE of these issues to their attention it would be fixed, overnight . I mean you know the @ElonDevTeam reads this forum as much as the official forums cause HWS is the hottest test bed, so they know the issues…they ognore them because its the scummy PVP player base that are suffering.

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too many broken toys in the box has been a major issue for a long time running. the devs seem to focus more on the aesthetics and ignore the performance issues that would make massive online play much more enjoyable for all aspects. sadly they feel things like sitting on furniture is much more important than a damn crouch button. hard truth is no matter the config magic rex has, the curveballs from eleon will hinder and even negate his hard work at times. function over form should be the desired direction for stability’s sake…

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I agree! For far too long my character is constipated and cannot take a proper shit, but can sit on a couch? I don’t see any ass flaps in the armor either, this is a must have.

So it’s either this or improved performance, instead of limiting what we use or our choices.

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Good point @op4 about having the balls to still ‘confront’ eleon team or server admins about the seemingly intentional degradation treatment of the PvP community at large, HWS tries its best to be a place for both PvE and PvP, which is great, but they cant do much further if Eleon adds more useless things… Example: why the hell did they add Titanium [and plat and aluminum or whatever} if you consider the last 2 to even be valuable… point being : they add more and more crap that we dont need and for what? imo all it did is shift the material economy in a huge way… no optimization to the base game, no show of anything that would give us the sense they are fixing things…

just look at what weve had to sacrifice for ‘better’ performance, we used to have unlimited number of cores available globally, now strict core limits and implementation of CPU, smaller builds… [Not HWS Fault]
so instead of fixing it internally [within the game code or whatever it may be] they just restricted even further just to improve things…

now tell me, anyone, has it gotten better at all since these things were put in place??? 11.5 GG played like crap… desyncs, crashes, low FPS , we chalked it up to the mineable terrain… but it was the same terrain/map since A9 far as i remember, and now the playfield can crash with only a 5v5 … something is wrong here folks.

[Small Edit: I bring up the difference of 11.5 from A9 as that was the last i played before took break from Empyrion, in A9 GG was rough with large battles, but nothing like it was when i returned in 11.5]

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Just quick some notes from me:

  1. @IceDrugg use the command “si off” if you don’t want that blocks collapse. Or use “cm” to switch to creative mode any time you want.

  2. I did not answer to such feedback, since I already announced that I will change it.

  3. I had a Skype call with Eleon Dev about this lag shot topic not long time ago and he explained me how it works and that it can happen because of “interpolation” and collider.
    That is the reason why after your test fight, you had some holes inside the layer of blocks.
    But maybe 2021 will come a complete new rework of collider where no lagshot will be possible anymore.

  4. Politary has sent me a video about it and I was able to reproduce the issue and at that time it seemed true. Later, after the release stress of HWS 12/13 I tested it again and saw that projectile speed doesn’t matter.
    TL;DR: I made a poll to change Configs mid season or not and all said I should wait for HWS 14. So in HWS 14 I will revert/change things. Unfortunately I just need more time.

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You know, topic begin to look like old PvP farts are chilling on a bench and complaining about life :grinning: We actually need to act somehow to make PvP comfortable. So, what are the options?

Work with Eleon. Not an option at all, really. Devs keep failing every major update, its like a tradition already. In our community we even don’t care about changes, our two main questions are: are new bugs implemented and are old bugs fixed? :laughing: Its all wrong but all these endless possibi… oh no, i mean bugs… they became a game’s feature. Even after 1 billion years I can’t imagine clear working Empyrion.

Work with Rex. Weeeeeeeell, its a tricky and edgy path, you can be banned for this, just believe me :rofl:

First of all thanks, didn’t knew it!

I just don’t even want to ask why the hell its not fixed still…

Here I just hope it was last time you took Poly seriously.

Yeap, it was clearly right decision - freeze the config for 3 month and let people “suffer” in PvP. Sure, man is a master of adapting by nature, but is it a right way for us, globally? I think its not. So why wait 3 months, any reason? Just because all PvE people said so? They don’t go PvP for real so they will not notice any differences. Tiny PvE miners will always die fast from PvP predators, no matter the cfg and EWS.
And here comes the problem. I remember it clearly. We tested our CVs 1 or 2 days before HWS start 13 with latest HWS config from github, all was fine. And on my first CV battle on actual HWS 13 server I was shocked - why the hell weapons act like crap?.. Where it comes from? Rex, I read pretty much all your post, announcements, etc… and your new EWS was like sudden lightning strike from clear sky, we were absolutely unprepared… but whatever, we can rapidly adapt, etc… but wee need to wait 3 months for new rebalance, why? Yeap, I know, it’s a rhetorical question.

Thx for detailed answer, its exactly what we need!
Another problem here. As we all know you have better knowledge and understanding how we should play. But pretty often you get sad soon because in reality we play different way, not like you imagine. Well, considering that fact maybe is it wise to share your actual PvP thoughts before season start and discuss it with PvP community (not PvE community, its important)? Yea, I know, you got no time for this, but pretty much nobody don’t wanna wait another 3 months for another “I got no time” answer. So what is the solution here? I believe not wait 3 month for sure, make changes during the season. Cause im present moment everybody have zero idea about what you are going to change and how it will work on actual server.

@RexXxuS, to be real you can skip it all… but for me I got only one really important question. I’ll ask it again and highlight it for you with bold caps for clear vision.

WILL WE BE ABLE TO SNIPE CV’S TURRETS IN HWS 14 WITH MOUNTED WEAPONS OR NOT?

Hoping for the clear answer, thank you.

Also we got 3rd way. Its do smth ourselfs :slight_smile: I mean, what we got in PvP now? We got single Eton event and it is kinda not so attractive now.
xxDMs are pretty much boring cause you can’t bring your vessels there. Default vessels are not satisfying in best case. What is the interest here? You build smth, fight, analyze damage, rebuild, fight again. When you forced to pilot same PvE style junk vessel again and again - you get bored pretty fast.
Wild PvP. Oh… since last EWS changes the influence of personal skill has been minimized. Dumb mass and quantity rules. I’m not HR manager and I’m not interesting to harvest 50 lowskillerz all over the Empyrion world. Also I don’t need that much people to buy me a beer. So I give up here, JVI wins, they can harvest their crops.

But I got an idea of PvP championship. Its kinda organized PvP fights with strict and clear regulations, clear goal and win criteria. No BS like infinity reinforcements, structure spamming, resource drawing, etc. So if HWS 14 PvP will go wrong and I would not be too damn lazy as always, I’ll try to organize it. So, everybody welcome, even hardcore biocoded PvE guys :slight_smile:

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Short answer: definitely, and highly doubtful. But you have deco trees in space that die when a hole is punched in your hull. And zirax shits are in 4K quality. Toilet sitting not functional at this time. Butt-bots will soon be a thing as we proceed to do runaway hell burns with the engine.

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@RexXxuS during your next call with Elon would you ask them wtf the PVP community did to deserve such treatment from them? We would ask ourselves, and some have, but most of us are ignored or banned from the forums. :rofl:

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Isn’t it obvious? For trolling devs for their low quality released product.
Ban/kill/remove criticism (even in sarcastic manner) is the easiest way of a caveman. Not everybody in this world are ready to accept and admit their mistakes and work for better results.

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Or simple. Empyrion was never made to be pvp :smirk::smirk:

Will not go into this discussion full force as I am not a major pvp player my self.
But, I agree that pvp have been to none focused in the game in general (not in hws)

But in a small defense for devs, when I read the feedback from many pvp players, i kinda understand why they give a fuck :see_no_evil:

Words like useless, fu** and stupid is more than often used again and again… while pve players more write a constructive feedback.

Just my few words…

Now!! Home for Christmas :+1::+1:

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I mean…ya very much so, but maybe Rex can get a straight answer…

And again, you are spot on. The Eleon forum is full of fanboys that continuously praise them for the new chair to sit in, or the new deco console they can incorporate into their Star Wars fantasy roleplay night.

HAHAHHA…definitely not Eleon Devs. Those guys get but hurt the moment someone is even slightly critical of their work! :rofl:

PVP feedback started out very civil and focus on game mechanics and performance which was in Elons best interest to focus on, yet they ignored us and cranked out new deco blocks and bugs with each release. So ya, the PVP guys got frustrated and tired of being ignored. I am one of them. Prolly on of the first bans in their forum was me…or Ice lol. At the end of the day they…well @Pjams summed it up already…

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