may be you right
but every 6 of old players not playing now, im asking why not playing
they said, will wait new changes in saison, and may be they will join again …
we lost old players, because of many changes, and
we lost donaters, because hws dont have sustainable support for donations
i dont know, how newcomers will come and that they want, but better to make more focused tailored environment, rather new perfected system, but with a lot of unfinished ideas …
ps. today 105 days, and we dont have banking perk ! which announced by Admins
One reason is definetly changes, class allowed changes especialy. But i think those was necessary changes. We are basicly on bottom now, cant go any lower unless class 0, so on this part we reached maximum. And it kind of works.
Rest is not playing because of base game is screw up badly.
I think its best time to do the rest of changes asap, and then leave it for some time as it will be as i agree with changing all all the time is not good.
I’m not quite sure of the practical implications of 3 vs 5 origins, but here are my thoughts.
I want whatever will make the developers’ lives easier, freeing them up to add more features to HWS. If you think reducing to 3 origins will do that, then do it, but if origins are “just working” in their current state, then work on something else.
If you feel that origins are just horribly broken, or if you actively spend a lot of time balancing the 5 origins, and you feel that a refactor would solve these problems, then reduce to 3.
If, however, origins are already more or less balanced, and you don’t spend a lot of time on them in their current state, then leave them alone, at 5. Don’t spend valuable hours fixing something that isn’t quite broken, when you could be adding new features to the game. Beyond the time spent writing the code is the time spent tweaking and balancing the code once written. I’m not sure we all need to go through that right now.
You have a limited number of hours to throw at development work, and I would like them to be spent on the things that matter most. Number of origins hasn’t had an impact on my life, though others may have a different experience.
Some other thoughts:
If you reduce it to 3 origins now, in a few seasons, you may very well be changing it back to 5 again when the game dynamic with 3 doesn’t play out the way you like/expect.
If the number of active users starts to rise, you may want to have 5 origins in place to allow sufficient diversity.
Perhaps some smaller, more targetted tweaks at the existing 5 origins to fix any glaring balance problems would be better? I don’t know. I’m not exactly sure what problem is in such need of fixing that it demands hours of Jascha’s time over other, new features.
Is it possible to add an origin indicator to your name?
for Example I am Guardian and my faction is The Promethium Project so the front of my name would say:
or something of the sort
I would like a way to at a glance figure out what origin a player is. As a guardian I have strict penalties for killing some other players. But If I am attacked or I am fighting over a resource node I have to be extra careful not to kill a player before I can figure out their origin, and I cannot stop in the middle of a fight to figure out what origin a faction is under. Hopefully everyone in that faction is the same origin.
I dont want to have to pull punches when someone attacks me.
Imo, 3 Origins are better than 5, like you said Rex, good / neutral / bad seem more accessible for everyone and easier to manage so all good to go.
But i would really prefer origin planets to be full PVP with all ppl from 1 origin being allied by default and planet accessible for everyone, so we got that feeling back of protecting your origin planet, meeting new neighbours, helping each others from the same origin, feeling that war can happen anytime
I agree with you on all counts, even to [quote=“Elfias, post:8, topic:7217”]
make it atractive with small change, balance it. [/quote] rather than make massive changes.
The one thing I have not seen in HWS, is a master plan of what the server is meant to be. This is why I have defended and argued against the changes to OCD, and the banks (initially against the banks, now against these changes). Without a master plan, contently changing things on a large scale, firing blindly into the night, is exactly like the elderly futzing around with something, rather than getting anything accomplished. These changes which are being made, do not support or detract from the game’s features, rather, they look like someone desperate to find meaning by painting the walls of their house and rearranging the internal beams of said house, without a blueprint to use as their guide. Without such a master plan, the beams you cut out, weaken the roof and will collapse the whole structure.
This is one of the problems I have with you Rex, like so many who just like attacking people they do not understand, you call anyone not sharing your vision a negative term. People don’t do as you want them to, because they don’t see a master plan, a reason to do anything. They like the game enough to spend hundreds of hours playing it, but don’t do anything in the server, because they don’t see a reason to… These seasons only hurt the server more, because the player (like myself) sees no point in contributing hours of game play to an organization larger than myself, when said organization is to be destroyed every 2-3 months. This too is why I was and still am, against the change you made to the OCD. We cannot deconstruct and take with us, our equipment (as effectively) as we could before. We cannot take with us hour multiple hundred thousand types of ammunition we stored away, and built up in preparations for war (because by the time we stored said weapons and equipment, the season is over (see how Dragon and I have become more active in PVP, just ask E4G, we hit them last night).
Most of the most successful stories barrow from the basics, rather than using needless complexity which fails due to continuity errors which appears as a result of complex stories.
Alliance = Trader and Guardian’s on one planet, either having their factions auto allied, or (quasi) force them to ally with each other on their planet.
Freelancers = trusted by no one, as they can support either team. They are gray, they stand where shadow meets the light. (see barrowed Babylon 5 reference).
bad guys = Pirate and Hunters, who ever thought that bounty hunters were good guys? I always saw bounty hunters as being the kind of people who did whatever they wanted, just were a little better at leaving no witnesses, because they were former military, police, or otherwise professionally trained, but could not handle being that much of a good guy or were betrayed by their commanding officers when following illegal orders. In this way, you could merge hunters and freelancers, given that the freelancers are gray and not black or white.
Love this idea, the structure itself is the capital for each origin, can be put to siege, but not destroyed. Each origin can store goods in a sv/cv/hv like vessel to rebuild (with the historical precedent of storing resources away in underground tunnels when one expected their city to be sacked.).
There is master plan, its just attacked and destroyed by problems with base game.
6.0 a lot of work put in just to be wasted…too much performance needed.
Logical step another server Sanctuary…just to be misunderstood by players and got bad name due to notfinished csw at launch (o2, fuel, groups) and server problems (harddisk, overheating, disconects)
Class change…necessary step finaly made, now it cant be worse and beside all the problems, i had smothest combat so far on planet, sadly since 6.7 game is not playable.
And so on, so my opinion is that Rexxx is doing whatever is necessary to improve our experience and those steps are good to do and logical, but theres always something to set him back, i forgot new expensive server…must have been hard to chew to see its not helping. Still he fights on, i call it dedication. Thanks for that.
So Rexxx do major changes now, all of them, turn it whole upside down if necessary, playerbase dont like to many changes and there wont be better time to do it. Once done make it permanent foundation since now. Players will start to come back one by one as always if they will see changes are finished and they can trust all is stable. Stability was always reason for me to play (includes OCD and server being online for nerly 2 years now)
Make it minimal so it can grow once game is ready for that. Make it 3 Origins.
Simplicity, stability, trustworthiness for better pew pew!
P.S: I love this transparency and us being informed and asked for our opinions so we all can participate on HWS future
Thanks for your thoughts @eckso. It is always hard to decide what direction is good or not.
But I agree with some opinions that we added to much features lately and did not fix older problems or are bound to them.
So doing the change to 3 origins is basically a fix.
At least I see more benefits than problems with it in the long run.
Only thing I agree is that 5 Origins are always better to difference stuff than 3 of course. And taking away existent code and adding it later back, even with Git history, is still a pain.
I will make sure that the step to 3 isn’t an easy no brainer decision. We had 5 Origins for 1,5 year now. I have a kind of reference here.
In the end it is coming down to 1. maintenance (guide, balancement, features) and 2. performance for the server.
We had this discussion already @Lokiet. I don’t know why Tesla and you are so persistent pains sometimes or like to force me to repeat myself although I said I hate it. Logical sense: you want to anger me - with quite success so do not wonder my reactions.
The HWS “master plan” is available in the Guide. Let me quote it for you:
Now you come up with your weird real life analogies or what ever why there stand philosophy and not “master plan” but deal with it.
Other than that this game and server is still in active development. You won’t get a roadmap from us and damn if you can’t live with that, please go.
Obviously our goal / plan is to improve non-stop and we won’t stop only for few people hugging the “no-change” policy.
I mentioned the reasons for 3 Origins in simple, plain english without your real life analogy - hopefully still understandable.
Last but not least your own words are your own downfall.
You see? You wrote “I”. “YOU”. But you go ahead and generalize it to
Stop thinking that everyone ticking your way and spread hate speeches all the time against HWS or me.
I do not attack anyone with bringing studies and analyzes that smartphone games changed the way people play, communicate and live. That is a fact.
We called it season, default is called full wipe. It doesn’t matter. That is the circumvent an alpha game has to go. Again you are free to go and play a stable game.
If you can’t live with that and understand why we changed it please go also. Really crazy how you still persistent on that change even though the whole world understood why it was needed.
So that was my last time responding to you with all the needed words for it.
I see zero relations to the initial Poll from you in that post so I have to remove all coming unrelated content.
You have sometimes good suggestions but sometimes it goes too wild.
Last but not least: please if you don’t like me (what you have confirmed now) and don’t like how things are running here you are free to leave.
The reason why Origins could be nice:
Roleplay, story telling, Diverse play styles, Encouraging players to compete & collaborate, resulting in an enrichment of gameplay (this is basically why people join multiplayer), better server performance (through different starting planets).
The basic problem with origins is that collaboration & competition between members of a certain origin and even between Origins cannot be forced technically at the moment through:
Forcing alliances between traders and guardians (example)
Disable friendly fire within an origin or between origins
No reliable way available to quickly identify a player’s origin (factions can contain different origins, so you can’t be sure which origin you are facing in PvP)
So the only way to compensate this, is to give certain origins high rewards or high penaltys for collaboration or competition, encouraging people to ally or fight each other.
At the moment HWS offers some of these:
There is a high penalty for guardians and traders, if they kill each other. So HWS is forcing them into alliances a bit (collaboration).
There is also a reward for guardians when killing a pirate, provoking competition between Guardians and pirates. But that’s pretty much it.
There is not a single “global reward” for origins, if they follow their role. Let me give an example to explain what I mean:
There could be a kill counter for guardians and pirates that is reset every day. If pirates kill more guardians than guardians kill pirates, every pirate would get +1 Bonus RP for that day and vice versa. I am just giving a very unfinished example here, but I hope you get my message:
Collaborative and competitive gameplay needs to be more rewarding. If you want origins to be more than an RP element, implement global origin rewards for achieving common goals. This will give people much more reasons to work together.
At the moment origins are only a diverse set of RP bonuses with a different story and different types of starter planets. That’s already a lot and reason enough to like it, but it is still lacking huge potential.
As long as the technical means are not there to make origins work flawlessly I would not put more efforts into it. We cannot test right now, how player would behave if there were forced alliances for example. Or Origin tags in the player name. This would drastically change things.
The Origin idea is great and it’s potential is huge, but it’s too early for the current state of the alpha.
This is a very good reason why I would decide for 3 origins.
What you call negativity, is what most people call criticism, which is not a negative thing, it is part of the creative process. If all you want is platitudes and safe places, then I advise that you go to one of the US universities. I am a computer graphics artist, writer, and content creator (an actual 3d modeler), and know first hand that the best way to improve something, is to speak about what is wrong and offer suggestions to fix it. I’ve done that in every post… Which is why they are so long. It is not my fault that you stop reading.
If major changes are to be made with this new build, then I agree. Make them the bedrock, and make small changes from here on out.
To put it into terms that I use in my computer graphic career. You build the base model, and then make small, minor changes, and upgrades. But from the first to the last iteration, you can see that the final product, is born from the first, the bedrock. This is how I work with Lightwave 3d, and this is how I work with Zbrush, photoshop, and Indesign.