HWS Patch - RP and Tax

HWS Announcements
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3 Likes
62

Another solution would be free structures per player.

For example faction with 5 players will have 5-10 free wihout or smaller tax structures and the rest with surcharge.

Youā€™re talking about spamming structures this would avoid and normal PvE players could keep playing.

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You have never tried living in space or you would not make this comment.

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problem with the 50k is that the graphics start shimmering. It;s like someone taking my monitor and shaking it. Not easy on the eyes.

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Yeah thatā€™s why nobody goes that far out. Mid 30s is enough.

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Is this formula actually correct?

(30% * structure amount) per structures cost * structure amount

Surely the formula is:

30% * (structure amount ^ 2) * structure cost

WHY is there a squared power being added here??

This in itself is converting the 30% into a horrendous %, the tax would be acceptable if there was no power of 2 being applied, there is just no need for that to be there.

this means that for each additional item the total effective tax % is:

1 - 30%
2 - 120%
3 - 270%
4 - 480%
5 - 750%
6 - 1080%
7 - 1470%
8 - 1920%
9 - 2430%
10 - 3000%

Now please some mathematician correct me if I am wrong here, but all I can say is WTF to that.

Unless Rex you have a dark side, we have to protest that that tax % is excessive even for you.

Re-reading the tax from the HWS V4 guide shows a slightly different formula, so I think this needs clearing up.

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I dont live in space, you can find out from the discussion :))

Just know how many times I managed to find base just that I flew into my own. Many times we just flew behind someone waiting to lead us to it. Damn, I even managed to inadvertently port to base.

Thereā€™s too many ways, and I can not imagine and I do not want to store our ships for a long time this way.

Funny that I discuss this issue especially with pvp Players who do not pay taxes and this problem does not affect them. Only with argument ā€œWe can do it so you can do itā€ but we dont want.

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Right. And rexxus wants you to so the servers rules are being developed surrounding that.

Soā€¦adapt or die I guess?

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69

Thatā€™s a bit harsh but to the point. At the Server listing for HWS it says in Bold MODS | Hard dynamic PVPVE Universe.

Given that Rex is doing all he can atm to keep the server people happy playing with a Early Alpha Game that has 60+ people online most hours and our little tid bits of drama here and there itā€™s wonder 99% of most Servers are empty.

GM burn out.

btw I promise if you loose a ship , base in pvp no matter how big , with ocd being used, you can replace it all in very short order. So STOP worrying so much about pixels and try to have fun right now. Go out into space. What do you have to loose ?

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The tax SHOULD be like this suggestion of mine, plz like only if you agree with it:

The way its handled right now is:
(30% * structure amount ) * structure amount , like Dukesatan said 30% * (structure amount ^ 2) ,
and then this result is been multiplied for each single structure :
like structure one to ten:
1 - (Curret Structure cost) * (30%) * (structure amount ^ 2)
2 - (Curret Structure cost) * (30%) * (structure amount ^ 2)
3 - (Curret Structure cost) * (30%) * (structure amount ^ 2)
4 - (Curret Structure cost) * (30%) * (structure amount ^ 2)
5 - (Curret Structure cost) * (30%) * (structure amount ^ 2)
6 - (Curret Structure cost) * (30%) * (structure amount ^ 2)
7 - (Curret Structure cost) * (30%) * (structure amount ^ 2)
8 - (Curret Structure cost) * (30%) * (structure amount ^ 2)
9 - (Curret Structure cost) * (30%) * (structure amount ^ 2)
10 - (Curret Structure cost) * (30%) * (structure amount ^ 2)

then you make a normal sum of this 10 structures you have , thats all ur costs.
insanely expensive, and not acceptable tax rather than very expensive, versatile and playable that ll make you move ur vessels out as i did suggest on my post.

71

As a test I had cut down my base to minimal, the tax came in at 1,000 credits, this is for a 23 device base, no CV, no SV present on the planet and a total of 42 RP.

I then added my Nano Truck, a 16 device SV, the tax has just now updated.

Each structure is demanding a 100,600 credit tax, thatā€™s a total of 201,200 credits.

Based on the formula we know:

(30% * structure amount) per structures cost * structure amount

There are two structures which each should have an basic cost as follows:

device * 1000 / RP (Minimum of 1,000 if less)

  1. base: 23 * 1000 / 42 = 547.62 credits, therefore 1,000 tax
  2. SV: 16 * 1000 / 42 = 380.95 credits, therefore 1,000 tax

Additional tax per structure (Total 2 structures):

  1. base: 30% * 2 * 1000 * 2 = 1,200 credits
  2. SV: 30% * 2 * 1000 * 2 = 1,200 credits

Total tax cost: 2,400 credits.

Can someone PLEASE explain to me how following the indicated formulas just how on earth does the tax system on the web site list my total tax as 201,200 credits???

Clearly SOMETHING can not add up, is it me? or the Tax system?

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72

I honestly donā€™t get why everyone is complaining. People should not be building multiple bases, svs & parking cvs on faction planets. The way I personally see it is a place to build ONE(1) base that you can safely use to store all your ore for crafting etc in case you lose your cv in pvp or w/e the case may be. Then you have a back up place that is in perm pve that you can rely on to rebuild your cv/svā€¦ whatever it may be. Iā€™ve been playing for a week and half on the server, I own 3cvs, 3 svs and 2 hvs and I live in space and havenā€™t been messed with once.

Taxes only hit once every 24 hours, Build a nice base with lots of cargo/constructors on the faction planets, park your cv in deep space and use a sv to go back and fourth. You pay literally chump change in taxes, you get to store all your valuable items that canā€™t be messed with and this allows more players to do the same instead of one person taking up 4-8 cores.

And like LBP said, You honestly donā€™t even need a base on these plantsā€¦ I just see them as a perm pve planet to keep storage safe without any need to worry about it and youā€™re taxed to do so. :sleeping:

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73

First of all, a big thank you for the update!

The tax increase is a good thing, but it does not seem to display correctly in HWS Connect. I believe thatā€™s where the most of drama in this topic stems from.

Hourly reputation gain for active players is a great introduction, as it actually rewards the active players and gives them a way of keeping the RP high even though they die more than those who play a couple hours per day. But as @TinyDewDrop noted, it makes Alliance and Hunter factions daily bonuses an unbeatable source of credits. 48k cr per square day is way beyond reasonable. It is required to limit this somehow and do it fast unless you want every alliance and hunter member to be a millionaire. I would suggest using square root of reputation instead of currently linear multiplier, sqrt(RP)*1000 would make a sensible amount of credits in the begining (~5k dayly) so that the new players still notice, it would not be OP (as even with 10000 RP youā€™d get only 100k/day) and it still keeps some incentive to grow your RP higher (compared to ā€œcappingā€ the total income). Iā€™m also not entirely sure how the HWS marketplace buy bonus works, but you need to make sure it does not get close to 100% even with 10000 RP.

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@everyone

The tax system will be activated on monday 9AM (UTC+1) / 3AM (UTC-5)

we will adapt some things here and there and verify everything. Thanks for your feedback. But still prepare to reduce your amounts. The more structures you have there the more expensive it will be.

To be able to get stuff faster removed we decreased the Decay Time to 3 hours instead of 7 hours now.

@Veber and @all: sorry, of course we also adjusted the income of hunter and alliance in the same run. 150million would be too good :wink:

So it is 100 * RP per hour now for Alliance and Hunter if conditions met

I updated the supply packages to the new slot sizes and ammo types

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@Mordgier: I repeat:

Itā€™s about getting unfair advantages over non-paying-players or getting stuff that impacts gameplay (not purely cosmetic) that can only be obtained through real money or trading with players who bought it with real money, no matter how small the advantage.

Donator packages + OCD5 + perma tax advantage + a dozen other very small advantages = very big advantage.

Example: the donator packages alone (gave me 100k za, allowing me to build whatever I want without buying za on market and without mining it in the dangerous planet). This lowers trader income by a lot and I can play without risk while non-paying players can not. Yes it is gated by playtime but that can be easily dodged by afk-ing or from previous playtime long ago. Gave me a huge advantage for being a paying player.
Now add a perma tax advantage to that + everything else. And Iā€™m not gonna explain the extra faction presence you get from it, would make it TLDR and you did not understand me there. I hope that the server will focus more on cosmetic donations instead of a bunch of minimal pay2wins. Yes Iā€™m a hypocrite I also donated a few times I admit.

@stv: no factions should not be allowed to have 5-10 free structuresā€¦ Imo we should also increase the minimum tax, 1k = joke.

And again there must be a way to prevent an entire faction from going bankrupt because of 1 player making a mistake in the morning/night ā€˜killingā€™ everybody else and making everybody feel insecure:
Player X at 8:00 AM in the morning: Takes his CV to the faction planet to get some supplies.
Server: crash
9:01 AM: everybody in the faction with low rp now has to pay 6 figures taxā€¦ If he also had a docked SV then everybody with low rp is automatically bankrupt.

I feel so ignored by admin even though I know some things I write are so true and so OP even though some writings may be so dumb.

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hm I also think the Tax-Amount is not right according to the formulaā€¦I might have forgot to turn off the transfer to my Cayman Islands Account or I just put in a wrong formularā€¦
We will check it for sure.

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77

  • Public ships does not cost tax (for now!). But keep in mind that people can steal your stuff just before they get kicked. And that if this will be abused too often / big we step in.

  • 10k km around you every 15 minutes to detect pirates

  • Just online in the last hour. Not the full hour.

  • The income is adjusted, sorry for the delayed information

  • Bounty Hunter are meant as Ninjas for me. They are deadly but not rude like Pirates. Their goal is to kill precisely without big losses

  • I know. p2w is not the issue here. I wonā€™t do this regarding it. But the most people who buy donator planets just want to play minecraft / singleplayer on them. So I donā€™t want to crush them. I added the new way that you have to play 300 hours to get a donator planet or the deposits will be adjusted along your playtime. 1 hour played and buying a donator planet would mean you have a 1-10 deposit big resource field. Maybe I find a good formula for them too.

  • maybe we introduce soon a ā€œTax Bankā€. Where you have to pay in and it is only payed from there. For now keep track of your members.

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78

Thanks for the Example. That will help me to find the Error. I looked it up in the tool and see what you mean. Thats not right for sure :wink:

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Well, itā€™s good for now, but when youā€™ll see people with 1000 RP, myself included, youā€™ll reconsider it.

80

Thanks for looking into it, be aware the data is still arriving falsely on the tax tool as well.

The structure commander is reporting the correct 23 and 16 devices for my base and SV.

However the tax tool is not, it now claims my base has 102 device and I only just woke up and got online!!!

Iā€™ve checked the base and even after the updated version the base says 23 devices.

The base tax is now listed as 244,357.4 and the SV tax as 100,600 for a bank killing 344,957.4 credits.

I hope this tax system will remain on minimum or disabled until we are sure it is calculating correctly and can give a historical daily record so each user can contest such feeā€™s.

Update: 10:39 (GMT), both device counts now reading correct in the tax page, still 100,600 for each tax.