Let's have a conversation about Bases and Shields

Last night DS3 spent 8 hours in EU fighting against JVI, LEA, & RED. It was a great time. But many things were discovered during this fight. Shields are way too OP and Bases are way too OP.

There should absolutely never be any situation that DS3 has three people able to defend against JVIs swarm of 15+ players. But we did. For hours. We should have been raided 5x over. But our bases shields never dropped below 50%. Even when jvi pushed with their silly seige tanks and swarmed one side.

Another instance where bases demonstrated how OP they are is when DS3 and ABN did a combined tank drop on JVI. ABN had 20 tanks. DS3 had about 4-5. Again, I don’t even think we dropped shields to JVIs main base. This is just unacceptable considering the amount of pure fireworks that were displayed.

Finally, SV and HV shields. They are way too OP as well. Until proven otherwise, DS3 and ABN have some of the best SV pilots In Empyrion. We had 3 men targeting one enemy at a time to attempt to drop shields. These engagements would take 10-15 mins to successfully drop a shield. But by this time, the enemy player already retreated back to their unaided base. It is frustrating and unnecessary. The shields also recover much too fast. Dropping the shield for it to recover in a few seconds is maddening.

In conclusion, I really think you have the right idea with increasing HP and shields for vessels and Bases. I really do! But this is way too much HWS! Let’s try to decrease everything by 25% and see if that’s any better. Because right now it’s almost unplayable!

Thank you for your time and understanding. Many players have video if needed.

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I would rather appreciate Videos and Github issues… why do I bother with sharing my work on Github otherwise. It was also open to test way before HWS 13, as some requested too.
But the feedback sums up and I can only say that feedback on github were considered. I guess nobody tested it on that scale, so here we are. No big deal, the Config is a never ending story of balancing changes.

However, as I said to other complains already:

  • were Anti Matter weapons in use?
  • were Torpedos in use?
  • were a mix of HVs and SVs in use?

I wrote many times that BAses should be considered as endbosses and rather late game content. What many did in previous seasons, killing 3 bases with 1-2 HVs is not what you should get spoiled to.
For many many seasons bases were always laughed at. Nobody bothered really to create outposts somewhere and always did the “hit&run” approach.
Bases should not be totally “invincible” but a huge effort, smart EWS usage and team required to take them out.

Your report also states that the bases were defended by humans? So it was not PvE?
Maybe that is the reason you couldn’t win?

Did you try the same strategy while the enemies were (semi) offline?
I can only balance PvP or PvE, not those special conditions.

But it’s good you made at least a quick suggestion.

What is “everything” though? Damage of ALL weapons? Range?
Can you be more precise please?

A quick idea I have is to implement an Anti-Shield Mode for Plasma HV Turrets, like I did for Bases. You or your Co-Pilot has to manually select and shoot it but would wipe 50% of Base shields with one shot for example.

At least if Shield is the overall issue here.
For SV/HV fights I already commited a reasonable buff I think. Active with the next server restart in 1+ hour:

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“why do I bother with sharing my work on Github otherwise. It was also open to test way before HWS 13, as some requested too.”

It is impossible to test large scale battles on small dedicated servers. We don’t have the tech or the player base.

“killing 3 bases with 1-2 HVs”

I’ve only been in pvp since 11 - But I have never seen 1-2 hvs ever take out 3 bases.

"However, as I said to other complains already:

were Anti Matter weapons in use?
were Torpedos in use?
were a mix of HVs and SVs in use?"

All were used. Abn was using alien weapons - I believe anti matter was one, we attempted torpedos. Obviously mix of hvs and SVs as stated in my post.

" killing 3 bases with 1-2 HVs is not what you should get spoiled to."

Yeah I agree. But my faction has never created a super HV that has been capable of taking down 3 pvp bases. Lol.

" Your report also states that the bases were defended by humans? So it was not PvE?
Maybe that is the reason you couldn’t win?"

??? What on earth are you getting at here? Even if you believed my faction couldn’t win against jvi (lol), they also couldn’t win against DS3. As stated in my post… 15 jvi couldn’t raid 3 bases with 3 boys defending.

" What is “everything” though? Damage of ALL weapons? Range?
Can you be more precise please?"

As stated in my post. HP of bases (turrets) and Shields. Possibly shield regen time would be nice.

“At least if Shield is the overall issue here.
For SV/HV fights I already commited a reasonable buff I think. Active with the next server restart in 1+ hour:”

OK. Thanks.

What I mean: did you only fought against dumb turrets or humans with HVs trying to defend their base, which was obviously the case.
So what would have happened, if nobody would be around in the bases? Do you think those Bases (=POIs) would still be undefeatable for you?

Ok, is this the overall feedback and green light for everyone?

just sayn "anti matter " only space able to work.

And bases are to stronK actualy it will be better bases back to normal and nerv little bit hovers that should be the best way to go for everyone give me some hearts <3 :slight_smile:

Well a few scenarios for example.

  1. 1v1 in sv with a mix or weapons is almost a endless fight.

  2. 3v1 in sv with a mix of weapons is still super hard to even get the shields down or down enough to destroy the sv

  3. On NA 15-20 TAW could not fully take down 2 bases on gg while all in manned hvs.

Same issue last night on eu ds3 and abn couldn’t even destroy 1 tower much less 3 with shields using around 15 tanks and a few sv. Ended in a stand off because either could not push to destroy.

As far as the github goes. Most either do not know how to use or won’t be bothered making a new account and following a new platform just to.see whats going on

This is an important question still for me.

Why?

The biggest change was +1m Shield to SVs but for that damage increase to Pulse etc.
Is Rubber Banding your issue?
But then again, Anti Matter has Homing… maybe Anti Matter should be Ultra Effective to shields…?

Ok. Then I will maybe remove github all together again.

Please do not remove the github. Others use the config for things outside of PvP =)

2 Likes

I rather enjoy the bases being stronger. Maybe not to the point where they are now because, I also like the raid others bases. But I will say that I haven’t fully reviewed the new weapons. There could be a hyper effective weapon that will drop shields. I don’t really want the changes reverted back to Season 12 either though, I hated dropping down bases to know they wont make it through the day. There has to be a balance between having meaningful bases and not having a paper mache hut. I would hate to see a knee jerk reaction to this issue.

Same note its wild that 15 active people in an Org cant take down a base being defended by 3 people. So room for tweaking, but not overly so.

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Single base- a few people could do it
A base complex w/3 bases and hv surrounding it-
Still possible but unlikely unless youwould take a big force to do and alot of resources to blow

The shield almost never drop and when they do it seems the regen rate picks them back up quick

Pulse does %1-2 per hit with max weapon count

Anti-matter would be good if boosted a little bit being it more costly. Even though they have slight homing you can still dodge fairly easy i think it would even it out if boosted. Rubber banding could be a issue but also same scenario on a playfield with just 2 ppl and not a big scale fight

I think its a good thing for config. Just maybe more are unaware of how it works

I agree maybe a slight tweak. Work it little by little to where it needs to be with testing from all veteran faction

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I think if we move anti matter to ultra effective against shields, like it was originally mentioned, then SV combat shouldn’t take 3 weeks for a 1v1 and bases should be more similar to how it was back last season.

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Not true anymore.

By the way, the Epic Plasma Cannon handhelp does 25% shield damage per shot against SVs.

Ehm. They have one of the highest homing…

I think some more battles need to be made.
Some wrong assumptions are being done here…

Also I’m waiting for more feedback and bundle it all together then.
I tested Anti Matter Ultra Effective on shields and they hit like a truck then.

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perhaps the sv pulse or plasma could have a dual option like the handheld cannon.

bases are Over Powered overall.
. Just need something to do more to shields, sv needs more range. tiss all i am askin.

Just to be clear, I am against any nerfs this early in the season. Not all of us have had the chance to try out base durability. From the videos I witnessed, they seem to behave fine.

The fact that you cant’ solo them anymore is great.

To be clear,
NuclearDeaths is not apart of TAW, and he cannot speak on our behalf as to what happened during our base raid. There was not “15-20 players” attacking a base, that’s greatly exaggerated.

The general consensus I have heard from my faction mates is that bases are “smashable” and require cooperation and effort to take, as they should be.

Secondly, please do not remove github, it’s the first time we’ve had a real clear image of what you are changing and exactly where it’s being done. I know I have LOVED the ability to have the config in singleplayer freely, upto date and easily commented on.

No absolutely not. No greenlight from me!

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"Not true anymore.

By the way, the Epic Plasma Cannon handhelp does 25% shield damage per shot against SVs."

Just a bunch of people running around with plasmas trying to shoot SVs. xD
SV shields are still OP after “buff”.

I would pay at least 5mil credits to watch a video of that…

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make it into one of ur pvp events, Bob!!

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