with insane work and a cookie deal, @Jascha was able to bring back our very first version of the Block limitation into HWS!
We replaced it later as soon as the Classes were introduced because we thought that would be better for performance measuring. However with the “real” triangle count it lacked the potential of identifying “PvP” ships aka Damage soakers with tons of blocks but still Class 1.
This resulted in very long SV vs SV fights for example.
We are on a certain state where increasing the turret / gun damage with our HWS Config would create an even bigger gap between the “default” game and our HWS game.
So here we are.
What Block limits make sense on PvP hotspots?
Please discuss in a good way, share your insights and explain in best case why you prefer what Block limit and where.
SV Blocks on Golden Globe = 3000
HV Blocks on Homeworld = 4000
As usual any off-topic / salt comments are removed along the way
Thanks for your input in improving your gameplay/-fun!
Your HWS Team
Can you make an image of an SV or HV with the limited amount of blocks, so we know what we’re dealing with ;D Just a big blocky thing.
I don’t understand why there is now block limits. The main issue was the amount of bases not the class one sv or the hv. What next cv block limits? We already have sv/hv amount limits on each planet i don’t get way this new change unless you want to hamper creativity and drive people away from your own server. I say this because i don’t want this server to become another dead server. If i didn’t care i wouldn’t bother to comment and just leave. Not sure if i want to play on this server anymore. I’m seriously rethinking it.
There are some things you don’t understand but just ask instead of this.
Performance wise: yes.
As written it is now about gameplay / fun. Fights take quite long with SV vs SV because tons of armor layers and still Class 1. We can help with that in decreasing the blocks so fights are faster and more fun.
You are free to go.
Take care in that case.
Sense when are fast ending fights more fun? What logic is that? Your hampering creativity by limiting the number of tools people have to build their ships to last. But if your set on your ways its like shooting yourself in the foot. < Edited; thats what i meant. I love @RexXxuS
Where is the fun in being in an SV and fighting 2 HV and 2 SV and knowing you have no fear of losing?
Where is the fun in spawning 3 bases and knowing that your enemy has a 12k SV that can absorb all the damage and then fly away, not to mention your bases no longer have turrets on them.
There is no real risk in pvp atm, not unless you are completely silly and fly into 6 bases.
On my personal test server, I flew a 6k block SV over three fully armed bases - after 2 minutes I flew away.
Honestly I dont think you can go wrong here. Whatever you decide Rex. I always preferred my small agile SVs even in current meta. YAY BLOCK REDUCTION!
P.S. We can use creativity to adapt to whatever the new meta will be.
Okay, so we need numbers for RexXxuS. You had some in mind right? I have not added it up yet, so please put yours out there so we can get an idea. I have to go out tonight but will be thinking up some numbers. Thanks.
I am for 1000 or less on all pvp playfields. The same for HVs and SVs.
We do need to keep in mind BASES… With to limited a amount Tanks will become flying turrets and base sniping with be the ONLY hope…
But even that isnt the worst? Who knows. Still with ARTY doing SO MUCH damage, it may need to be adjusted a little to makeup for the lack of blocks.
How do these new paper thin SV/HV take on towers grouped to 4 6 or 10? This will make towers gods.
Honestly they only do this much dmg BECAUSE of the TANK SVs/HVs. With less blocks, even the config can be changes. End result… Less lag.
I’m saying this from the perspective of a new player as I am new to the server, but I also have the experience as a veteran and know how easy it is to join friends and together grind out a ton of resources.
The SV “sponges” as all sides have accurately labeled them further increase the gap between new players, solo players, and veteran players in large factions/alliances. In an SV sponge you can effectively hold out against a decent solo player until help arrives. A new player or faction trying to grind for resources either has to resort to sneaky tactics or ask for permission to mine/join an alliance in order to have the resources to begin sinking them into SVs capable of competing with these heavily armored SVs and HVs.
As usual I’m going to weigh in on the side of “Let’s try this out and see how it goes.” It might turn out that we like it and end up with some creative builds that are in fact more fun to play/PvP with than those monstrosities we see on the field right now. Maybe the end result will be having a completely different playfield where these limitations are put into place and GG/Homeworld are returned to their former glory. Let’s try it first before attacking the very fiber of the suggestion.
Overall block limits are a step in the right direction; not only will it encourage more diverse designs, but interactions will have a better potential of resolution.
A flaw with the approach is that not every interaction is Type vs Type so there needs to be a normalization of block health and weapon damage between types, ie a rocket from an SV weapon would do the same damage as a rocket from a BA etc.
Some of the proposed upcoming changes such as thrusters needing to be exposed should also help to alleviate conflicts that are drawn out due to “brick” designs.
I definitely agree that there has to be a higher block limit for each and every type of base or vessel to balance pvp and certain areas performance.
Not sure how much it should be but ill do the math soon, right now high mobility ship builds don’t pay off compared to block boxes with “low mobility”, risk reward is broken.
Cockpits should have way higher HP and (if possible) force to place on the exterior of the ships.
Materials are not hard to come by for a pvp session, crafting a ship and doing ammo. Farm is time consuming but its not an issue since there are still pve places. I believe the server should aim to generate and promote more challenging pvp escenarios for players to design smart ships and not just giant boxes that end up being very long silly fights.
This works to revalue and repurpose the idea of owning, fighting or defending a base or a ship.
To go with block count nerf i would suggest adding more accesible recycling tools and reduce blueprints spawn time. Maybe taking a look on projectiles speed and max range.
And please… for the good of player interaction, focus high tier resources on specific pvp planets. Its so easy to get materials anywere that the only purpose of pvp is to raid or defend a base, and its not enough to encourage people to do stuff outside pve planets.
A single 3k block SV can take 60 - 90 seconds of sustained fire from 3 bases before dying/imping away.
If you want to make the fight more dangerous obbligate ppl to keep their thrusters exposed (Space engineer like) or Ask dev to implement that as thay did for weapons. This will make Fight very dangerous and this would be a way to limit the Class naturally. (you cant place as many thrusters as you want because the exposed surface is limited)
I personally like how everything is right now… i really think u nailed it rex… but if you lower the block counts, svs will be useless against bases… but whos to say we wont roll it with tanks? if hvs are also limited then bases will be overpowered and it will be a matter of who spawns a base first… but if you MUST do this, please dont split up the block limits per planet… i already foresee u wiping out my whole line of sv fighting blueprints… i really dont want to make an sv per planet…
i dont see the reason why u need to test svs on bases… we will roll them with hvs, and then u will want a limit on hvs as well
My suggestion would be to lower SVs to the following:
2.5k - 3.5k
3.5k - 4.5k
2k blocks (delivery ships)
All PvP hotspots should have this limitation except Armageddon, since it has less reward.
For me PvP hotspots are the following:
Other playfields can stay the same, that way other players can go and enjoy their 45 minute long duels.
I think it would be wise to settle in the middle of the ranges I listed. SV = 3k, HV = 4k.
Blackhole Block Limit
I’m not sure what to put here, but I would like to CVs limited to class size 1 in blackhole.