Since we have now a “buy counter” of ships I do price adjustments regarding this mainly (and feedback). Will check after the new meta established.
You have nothing won with it I think.
First during prime time not even CV spawning is possible and secondly the abuse or reason why they are not allowed were sponge / decoy CVs, even if it would be just for 12 minutes.
Same would happen with the 500 limit. It takes a while until they are gone.
Players will just have to buy a garage ship and pay to sponge, lol. Should we design a garage CV with SV blocks for transporting only 
Hmm, maybe I have a different opinion about that. A single plane of 10x10 is 100 blocks. So if you build a hollow 10x10x10 cube, 1 layer of armor CV, that would already would already be ~600 blocks (6 sides). I think a base would be able to pop a 500 block CV in <30 seconds. A lot of the current garage SVs already have that same combat steel, so I don’t think it would be that much difference.
The CV sponges you were referring to from the last patch were 15-25k blocks with 30-50 layers of armor in the nose. I think 500 is a far cry from that. I can make a test video when I have more time after the Easter weekend to validate my claim.
I am just thinking it would be nice to be able to bring a warp sled down to use a Mjolnir/Fenrir/Badger and be able to take it with you when you are done. I’m curious if anyone has really bought any of the garage HVs due to the current CV limitation in prime time. Even a 100-200 block CV would be better than nothing.
I think the fact that it would have a CV core would still flag it as a CV. What Eleon needs to do is allow SVs and HVs to dock…we can only hope someday.
And you could manually replace the SV blocks with CV again. I thought the joke was obvious, sorry.
I Was finally able to get registered with the forums.
My primary class 1 SV is 1.46 and not a brick and about 4200-4300 blocks. I have made a version that is 2992 blocks that has become more brickish in order to meet the new limit. It became more brickish because all of the blocks that were more decorative than functional were the first ones to be removed.
I agree with you that I forsee the combat garage ships becoming kings of the battlefield and am not looking forward to that at all.
So now that we have solid numbers I checked my faction/alliance library for standard HVs we used on many of our battles on GG last season.
This HV (we used) is on the steam workshop.
Block Count = 4995
Now I agree they are hard to kill, but in the large battles on GG we would inevitably lose all our non-garage ship tanks (HVs).
Here is the thing I remember. Driving one of these tanks in a prolonged battle, the Kislev (very slow and hard to maneuver btw) I would lose most/all turrets against smart SV enemies. So even though the enemy didn’t kill the tank they did neuter it.
Tanks are essential to attack and defend bases. If they are too “thin” (low block count) then bases become invincible.
@Stunner666, do you have specific tank experiences/knowledge that might counter my own and shed some light on your “too high” comment?
Thanks for your thoughts.
Thank you for this, I really appreciate your approach. Great Work!
My 8000 block HV died last night in about 30 minutes. Pretty sure you can kill a 5000.
Correction, the battle today it lasted 12 minutes.
Gotta be real careful with these, sometimes they’re real lemons.
Maybe with the garage ships, cutting the garage ship cost in half or more and putting a time limit on them instead, say 24 hour use? Maybe more for mining vessels. Treat them more like buffs rather than possessions. But also making them not able to be modified. Get some good prints in the garage… Make some viable pvp ships. Looks don’t win fights.
It is like Stunner mentioned, and the others admittet,you cant kill the Kirov, you can just strip it of turrets.
The current block limit wont stop the „war of the block bricks“.
So after reading most of the posts (not all because its somtmes a bit a hick-hack here) i where thinking, hey everybody likes to have "nice " SV ships, and we dont want 12k sponges. So heres my suggestion:
1: Make a verry low block cout for SV´s first, like 1000k
2: Make the Cockpits stronger, real stronger, like 5 Times Stonger
2: Push the HP of SV Hardent Steel Blocks up 2 or 3 times, set the costs of this blocks um 5 times.
What do we gain this way? SV´s will be smaler, we can build beautifull, but expensive SV´s we have low blockcouns and the ships will be less spongy, but able to take a few hits, while being also no flying cube.
They are gone for another round of impossible balance.
They will soon decrease turret and base hit points, then turret damage, then number of blocks again.
If devices have too much hitpoints, they will be used like blocks, in older version you could find ships covered with constructors or landing gears, there is no limit on the number of cockpits so they can be used as armor too.
Yup.
Splash damage kills you in cockpit and your ship is still intact. Until Eleon fixes the splash damage issue then these can’t really be done unless we want to tune down splash damage quite a bit.
Creativity is a phenomenon whereby something new and somehow valuable is formed. Creativity - Wikipedia
It doesn’t mean creating something new “all the time” just something new in terms of “something valuable.” It also doesn’t mean that something new is something creative.
Also being afraid of change doesn’t equal being afraid or against creativity because the old may be better then the new if the new is worse then the old. In history fear of change has driven many to create great and creative works like the Great Wall of China, like the Roman Hadrian’s Wall against the northern ancient Britons. Like the fear of change of the Spanish Christians in the Iberian peninsula (where my ancestors came from) of giving up their religion to Islam in which it drove them to fight for it, and they ended up expelling the invading Muslims from the Iberian peninsula.
Builders for the most part build to create something better otherwise they wouldn’t bother building anything. Further, something new can also be something bad if that something new is a bad; and i’m sure your not creating a new block limit system to create something bad; but something good correct?
There are many creative works which are ancient that will always be creative works no matter what new works come along, also there are ancient creative works that are better then new creative works and vice versa.
Pros and Cons
(Pros)> The benefits i see with lower block change is better performance (cons)> but at the cost of less tools for builders.
We can still build creative works with 3k block sv’s but to a lesser extent then before. This is a trend that has been happening for a while now.
A good question for @RexXxuS would be (cons) how long will it go before it completely eliminates creative ship building?
Cons: Garage ships; before it was almost impossible to kill one with regular pvp ships. Now it will be even harder. My question would be this: is this change meant to make it pay to win? Meaning that whoever has the most amount of gold and able to buy garage ships be the ones who will dominate everything?
Also, how will new players look at this server when they start realizing that no matter what ship design they build and that have spent hours and hours, and days after days perfecting their builds come to the stark reality that they won’t be able to compete with ‘cv’s’ i mean ‘sv’s’ “garage ships?”
I really wish you well Rexx; i know its hard to find a good balance when dealing with such matters. I know that you yourself are creative, and not only that, but innovative! I’m willing to see your changes @RexXxuS just to see what the consequences are because at the same time i’m learning something. :]
Regards and good luck to the HWS team.
That was already the case, you guys in your big factions/alliances just took your garage ships and modified them with even more armor. I really see no change here except now the garage ships have less armor.
Lots of stuff happened for lots of reasons in history and creativity has loads of different definitions depending on who you’re speaking to so all of that was a waste of time.
Before Garage ships were hard to kill, now Garage ships are still hard to kill. Before you would purchase garage ships and add armor to max out the block count, now you will still purchase garage ships and add armor to max out the block count. Nothing has changed for small factions and solo players. Maybe Garage ships have gotten harder for large factions to counter with standard PvP ships though, idk that could be a thing.
Someone set up a server with the HWS config and spawn in some garage ships vs some standard PvP ships to see how brutal the difference really is. Right now I’m pretty sure you’re working off assumptions and I think I saw somewhere else that standard Garage ships have lower HP values or some such, do correct me if I’m wrong though.
Simple to answer:
You wont be as able to add as much to the purchased build of a garage with regular blocks, resulting in weaker garage vessels than without the limits.
But; non-garage ships are, on average, going to be hurt one hell of a lot more in their ability to mitigate damage, and garage ships will therefore be stronger (much stronger, imo) against regular sv’s/hv’s, and weaker against bases (and cv’s where that’s relevant).
Whilst I strongly dislike hulking monsters and the difficulty in killing them in skirmishing, I’m … alarmed at how much this might impact the meta: the role garage ships play in it and the effective improvement of bases (which we’re already being spammed with) before they become manual-builds with alpha 8’s tools.