Charged for to many SV

======= NOTICE FOR HELP =======

What happened: i was charged for my faction having to many SV on gg
Player(s) with issue: Krieger50
Server: NA
Time (cb:time): 23:25 26 jan 18
Playfield: GG
Structure Name(s): Write here
Structure ID(s): Write here
How can we help you now: I was charged 3 mil for having to many SV on GG while i wasnt even online.

26 19:18 StructurelimitExploit paid 1003334 credits and 2 RP for exploiting (as faction) the structure limit with structure New Vwing 1.5(18305811)
26 19:15 StructurelimitExploit paid 1003334 credits and 2 RP for exploiting (as faction) the structure limit with structure New Vwing 1.5(18305811)
26 19:12 StructurelimitExploit paid 1003334 credits and 2 RP for exploiting (as faction) the structure limit with structure New Vwing 1.5(18305811)

Our faction was charged over 109 ish million credits for this. Im sure it has to do with updating, as we recycled ships, then spawned in new ones.


so far it looks right. @Jascha has to verify the numbers. You were the first who “tested” it so to speak.
Was some cool invasion I saw and some limits were broken here and there.

To point you to the two important “why’s” in chronologic order:

  1. HWS base destroying our bases - #28 by Jascha

Why would they be charged three times for a single seizure? and 33 million per charge?

Here’s what my experience was, as I was there spawning the replacement V-wings myself:

The faction was recycling after a dogfight, and I was watching the registry to verify that we did not exceed the 15 faction SV limit at any point in time according to the numbers displayed. I spawned two V-wings within about 30 seconds time and then quickly converted them to faction ships without exceeding the registry 15-max. Nobody else spawned replacement ships at that time.

After they got activated and used, within about 10-20 minutes I started seeing warnings about V-wings being confiscated. I believe I saw three warnings, and yet we had never exceeded the registry beyond my private registry owning 2-3 private SVs (before I converted them to faction ownership).

We were too busy fighting to care too much about what was going on. Fast forward a few hours later and someone notices that we have each been charged about 3million credits and rp.

This is what I saw.

I understand what is going on but I feel like instead of posts about base seized it will just be 200m in debt please help. Auto buyback every 3 mins is insane. I dont think anyone would ever be willing for hws to seize a sv. If so I dont understand the reason why. My opinion is to make the server white listed and they get white listed when they click I agree to the rules. If you were to split the rebut cost between all faction members then maybe. But I guarantee you that players will start dropping left and right over this with the way its currently implemented. That was a class 1 sv. Can you imagine a class 7 base? They would never get out of debt. If this is functioning as intended then I give it 3 months till server has less than 30 ppl at peak hours. I mean who can justify 10m per minute on a class 1 sv.

1 Like


As form said, no ships were claimed even though there were messages in chat. What is the evidence of this mechanic being used in violation of the rules you posted?

A.F.T. had the specific intention of using it offensively, but there was no intent (nor anything claimed) from TAW. Is there a particular member you can attribute this rule violation to?

also we werent even charged the correct amount. we were charged as if it were taken from a blackhole wipe, so we were charged twice as much. the ship is a class 1 also and we were charged 2 rp

You believe this is a fair punishment in a lag fest? 36 million per charge. 108 million credits. A punishment for being a large faction. Lots of players, need more ships pushed up to the limit in a lag fest fight.

A lagged server, TRYING to recycle and keep people in the fight. The larger the faction, the larger the fine. Zero reason not to split the faction 18 people per and only half the fine.

More important twice the ship limit and less chance we push this boundary. We removed all non PvP ships and still hit this. Our decision is easy, made sooner and we wouldn’t have received this.

It was a mistake. 1. Was calculated incorrectly. 2. If you read the rule that rexxxus linked it says for faction it is split between all faction members, not each member paying the full cost. And 3. We were charged 3 times for the same ship. The actual cost is about 16.6k credits and 1 rp per person. I just hope they reimburse the credits plus interest that some people missed out on due to going into the negatives

Hey guys, calm down :wink:
You know you can talk to us. (but I understand you are upset).

Well just to explain you that function:
1). Yes it takes double the cost (and the sv is quite big…4967 Blocks and 202 devices = 1mil; nothing to do with class) to punish those abusing this function (which was made for everyone’s benefit… or it was supposed to). Abuse = If someone spawns new structures even though the limit is reached.
2). Since RoP was still flying “New Vwing”, even though he got/should have gotten kicked out of the pilot seat during that time to be able to take that ship, you got charged 3 times (since the structure could not be taken). Which was also implemented since some abused this.
3) Its only made for PVP

But as you said. Maybe something is still wrong and maybe it is a bit overpowered. We will look into it and reimburse the costs, since you were the first that got struck by it. Sorry for the horror…

So what should/could we improve:

  • Not counting SV/CV abuse the same as a base (base was the initial problem we wanted to take care for). So SV/CV should be cheaper. --> For now I changed it to bases only.
  • I will check if the money is split among faction members, not taken the whole. --> EDIT: I found a problem here. Thanks for the info.
  • And I will check why it charged you one more time… the 3rd time, looks wrong actually --> Found also the error and fixed it.

Anything else I missed that should be changed/suggestions?

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All money and RP was payed back and you got a bit extra for participating at this “study”.
Sorry again for the trouble.

Lets now find a way we can punish those that exploit PVP but not those that mean it well.
Suggestions welcome.

1 Like

Thanks Jascha, I appreciate the understanding. As a large faction we are always right on the limit anyway, stuff like this hurts us much more than it would a smaller faction. No exploit was intended (and from what I hear, it was probably due to server lag/Empyrion being alpha).

From RoP:

“During the fight I spawned in a V wing, it didnt show up. There was a marker (green) but I could not see it. So during that timeframe I relogged to see if it was a visual glitch. When I logged back in, the ship was still not there but the marker was. Then, once the ship showed up, it was damaged to hell so I recycled it. So, during that time, wherever it was, it got shot up. The whole back was damaged. I was never in the ship.”

He said it took about 10 minutes to get back into the game, that would be enough time if the game thought he was in it or something.

As far as what to add:

  • This would count if a ship went overclass too, right? I think either more time needs to be added or the penalty be smaller in that case. Going overclass isn’t ever intended or easily fixed when in PVP.

  • Sometimes for one person the registry says there are 12 SVs for one person, but for another it shows as 17. This has happened to me personally at least twice this past week. I’m not sure punishing players for spawning an extra ship (which can be easily fixed as opposed to a base) is fair when the game isn’t always accurate on the count. We can provide proof of this phenomena the next time it happens, if required.

This should not be a problem at the moment since we catch that one with the tool. So we fixed that a few weeks ago that you don’t get directly punished/warned if your structure gets damaged.

Yeah would be good to know why/how that happens, and also what the tool says at that time.

@Jascha thanks, sorry we were heated but glad you were understanding. Im still a bit confused on one thing. The calculate, this is from the rules The cost is:

(Blocks * Devices) / 2 credits + RP* (in Starter system 1000 credits + RP*)
*RP as Class size

Buyback for Black Hole wipe mistakes:

(Blocks * Devices) credits + RP*
*RP as Class size

So this is calculated as a buyback for black hole wipe mistake or am I missing something? Thanks again. Im not trying to be argumentative. I just like to have all the info. Im supposed to be the know it all on our faction :laughing:

Thank you @Jascha for the refund and quick response.

Yeah, I try to make it more united to reduce confusion and complexity.

The common sense was just that Black Hole / limit abuse is more heavy than a buyback.
Will think about it.

Thanks, I was just curious. Im not sure why but I’ve noticed if I multi tool a ship completely I still see the green name but it falls through the floor repeatedly for a variable amount of time. Seen it last 5 mins but also several hours. Im sure there is nothing you can do about this but I could make a video of it so you can get it to the devs if you would like. Just let me know. Thanks

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