what exactly did you purchase that is in your OCD? what is being taken away from you that you spent money on?
@baju13 you havenāt read anything in this discussion at all. you skimmed and assumed then immediately went into bitch mode putting your grievances in the open for all to see the assumptions you have made here.
Youāre opening statement was: āThe Formation of a Totalitarian Regimeā
your reason for doing so was: "Inactiveā players with property in OCD and who once paid money.
so Iām curious to know exactly what you paid for that is being withheld.
you also claimed: I wonāt point my finger
you then instantly lied
you also claimed you are: being deprived of the right to private property
I didnāt know there was real estate available in this game for purchase
Iām not entirely sure where this comes from: stated that he is infallible
if youāve ever actually read the forums, you will see many times where heās apologized for many mistakes of the past
in this universe, this part is actually correct: Heās almost equal to God.
he did create this universe from nothing and set up a specific set of rules for us to follow. but unlike most Godās we pray to, this one respondsā¦
Bob, you donāt want to leave me. Itās so cute.
ā@baju13 you havenāt read anything in this discussion at all. you skimmed and assumed then immediately went into bitch mode putting your grievances in the open for all to see the assumptions you have made here.ā
Bob, I respect a job well done. This is where the bullshit really annoys me. If you deceive people, then at least do it well and beautifully.
āYouāre opening statement was: āThe Formation of a Totalitarian Regimeāā
Bob, you are inattentive. Again. See above.
"your reason for doing so was: "Inactiveā players with property in OCD and who once paid money.
so Iām curious to know exactly what you paid for that is being withheld."
Bob, pulling quotes out of context was taught very well in Soviet schools. I can do it much better than you. But this is a sign of low qualification. Donāt use this trick again. You can do better.
"you also claimed: I wonāt point my finger
you then immediately lied"
Bob, in human society there is such a thing as āHumorā. Maybe someday you will grasp this concept.
"you also claimed you are: being deprived of the right to private property
I didnāt know there was real estate available in this game for purchase"
More precisely, it will be āRentā. And not only the house, but the whole planet or even part of space. And some even do it. Imagine! Bob, take an interest in the possibilities of HWS, there are many more interesting things there. A professional should generally be in the subject of features.
āIām not entirely sure where this comes from: stated that he is infallibleā
Bob, that quote is inaccurate. The distortion of the opponentās words shows a very low qualification. Donāt do that again, Iām ashamed of you. And reread your posts from the last 14 days.
āif youāve ever actually read the forums, you will see many times where heās apologized for many mistakes of the pastā
Thatās right, Bob, it used to be. Once upon a time, Bin Laden was an obedient boy from a good family. But weāre talking about now. Not about a year ago, but about yesterday or today.
āin this universe, this part is actually correct: Heās almost equal to God.ā
You see, Bob, I didnāt lie.
āhe did create this universe from nothing and set up a specific set of rules for us to follow. but unlike most Godās we pray to, this one respondsā¦ā
Thatās right Bob, a set of rules. And now heās breaking them.
And do not write to me anymore, I will not return to you. Humble yourself. (it is humor).
By default and instinctively Iām against of any FORCED labor, but I admit, I might not have all the information to be 100% sure I donāt like what I see here. Or I dont understand what āinflationā we talk about. I assume its the credit prices of the items/materials on the market, right?
- Could a veteran illustrate with some examples the horrible inflation what supposed to be addressed with this?
My experience is exactly the opposite - things what were expensive when I bought them and stored in my OCD as a potential cashable wealth (like aux and quantum cores) are much cheaper now than 2 seasons ago.
-
If that inflation exists, arenāt t he ACTIVE players generate it? Passives donāt play so how the hell they could affect the market prices?
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In real life inflation happens when there is much more money than product, so people can afford to spend more money to get the products ā the MONEY has no value.
OCD stores products, not money, so we donāt remove the money from the system to fight the inflation, but actually do the oppositeā¦ destroying potential products from the market wont reduce prices at allā¦
Eg: imagine a passive player with shitload of gold in his OCD. When he comes back to play, and flood the market with gold, will the price of gold go up (inflation) or down?
So fighting the inflation should happen by removing the CREDITS from the systemā¦ less credits ā cheaper prices.
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perhaps inflation is the incorrect word to be used here. itās more of a critical mass situation. hereās a couple screenshots Iāve seen of one person and their alternate account OCDs
this person has been gone for years. everything he collected at that time was very easy to collect. currently it would take several seasons to amass the amount in these screenshots. imagine if 30 people with OCDs like this came in one day and just put everything on the market for less than 10 credits each. that would completely destroy the economy.
that is the main concern here. a small group ruining the game for everyone else. it has happened many times in the past and thatās what a lot of people donāt understand. it always looks like oppression when things are taken away. Even when itās for our own good.
Iām not biased, I just trust the person thatās been successful at this for the last 7 years more than new those who only have a narrow view from their own perspective.
to put it in perspective, thereās one player that constantly joins our discord and asks the same question every few seasons and then disappears. a long time ago there was an exploit that allowed him to amass a ton of resources very quickly. I wonāt go into details what that exploit was but he was very upset when it was fixed and left. he constantly comes back and asks if it has change backed to the way he liked it, then leaves when he finds out it hasnāt.
basically this is just a selfish a-hole who only cares about himself and not the community heās in. so in equal fairness, the community doesnāt care about him either. the reason this community exists is because we enjoy playing with each other and want the place to grow. those who are only selfish about their own gains donāt last very long.
thereās no āforced laborā or āsweat shopsā forcing us to make inexpensive products that are going to be on store shelves. the owner created content and is asking us to look at it. he has also open dialogue for us to gather ideas on how to prevent the critical mass situation at hand instead of forcing content on people. player inactivity is what we are looking to reduce. why should those who have been gone for years be rewarded for being gone?
those who only want to complain can go somewhere else with that nonsense. those who actually want to have a constructive conversation on how to prevent this critical mass from destroying the universe for everyone, please continueā¦
The more it goes on, the more Iām confused about what problems weāre trying to solve and why. Iāll mention a couple separately.
Exploits :
Plain and simple, Iām against any kind of exploits, and they should be hard corrected as soon as possible. Yes, this means a lot of individual efforts from Admins, Iām sorry about that, but I canāt see any other way to be protected from it.
Inflation :
Inflation means, prices getting higher, and money being worth very little then. But itās all depending on the normal market rules, availability and demand.
Quants were once, not so long ago, a great product to make money because it was rarer. Gradually, it became mostly worthless, because more people have enough, or consider high prices as not fit for it. Natural evolution, a lot of other products are following the same path, itās actually NOT inflation.
The one thing that ārecentlyā increase inflation, is the (too) hasty introduction of selling ships, which was a mistake from @RexXxuS (I mean no harsh critic, just fact that it was too early/unbalanced). This was inflation with the insane amount of cash flow inside the old economy. And it has also been corrected, maybe not perfect, but hey, thatās how new ideas work, you try it and improve as it goes.
Also money sinks (more levels of Recycler, increased credits prices for HWS features, etc) have been put in place.
So inflation, except a temporary problem, doesnāt seem something huge to tackle on right now.
Resources that become rarer in the current game version :
If one day, some resources (Carbon !) has to start anew, and WIPE carbon from OCDs, then FINE, letās just do it. Not condemn everyone because some people have it in OCD when it was available in a different/easier way.
Inactive or half inactive with tons of (old) ressources :
First and as a reminder, if it came from an exploit, it should disappear, no discussion on that xD
Is it unfair to currently players that some guys have 30 stacks of gold => Yes
Is it creating inflation (in the event that they would come back, which wonāt be all) => Yes and No
If they sell cheap resources, itās actually bringing prices a lot lower, which is not inflation. And as new, more important end-game resources have appeared, they wonāt be insane for gameplay either.
If they exchange them for Credits, it will bring them a lots of resources and then possibly yes, increasing cash is a problem. But as many other people mentioned, the current ACTIVE players (which is, apparently, what we care about) already have a much bigger impact on economy anyway, with high-end ārecentā resources, and top ships for farming in their own fields (being trade/fight/other).
So, what to do with these ? I hardly see a big problem, right now, from a game point of view.
How to be active :
All things considered, this might be the most important point.
Star fragment implementation is not interesting to me, thereās really no search, just time and penta. Sorry If I donāt see the point, and donāt want to do it, while yes I could. Itās also unfair to new players.
And this, as well as any other ingame activity, should be chosen by choice, not just because itās been added and thereās a focus on it. Some guy could spend 3 months buildings ships and bases because he loves that, heād probably be more active than some people getting SF.
If you want active people, why not start with Hours spent, as most people suggested ? Itās still sad for when you want to take a break, which happens once in a while, waiting for new things to try out, or busy with another game, then come back (Kinda like the idea about 2 seasons out means inactive, also)
Is it just a money problem ? :
Once and for all, would like to know, if weāre adressing a real dangerous problem (which, from my current text, I donāt understand or approve, so far), or really searching way to make yet another (real) money catch ?
I mean, Iām already Patron, also a DevOps, you can tell me the servers are expensive, you can tell me about the junk in DB because of hundreds of inactive OCD, or other technical stuff. I would understand, probably even agree, and then work for a reasonable compromise to help with either of these.
But hearing āYou have to go get the star fragment to keep your OCDā is really not the same, and that Iām definitely against.
Good day. A simple truth emerges from recent observations of the discussion. There is constant dialogue about old players that are missing and the amount of material in the OCD. So why not think about OCD, but about the time of absence? Indeed, in life, banks do not take deposits in order to attract customers, but come up with all sorts of tricks for customers. Letās return to the dialogue - maybe it makes sense to think about the time of absence? Just decide on a deadline - I, for example, sometimes go on business trips for up to six months ā¦ And what should I do now, come back and start working on OCD again?
A strange example with the amount of material in OCD, prices can be brought down with 5-10 items, and this will only affect active players, since beginners will be more worried not about market prices, but about the amount of material in OCD - right?
But hereās what puzzled me more. Before this announcement about the fragments, I didnāt know anything about them at all, but when I started looking for information about them, I came to a dead end. Only from tickets to technical support could I understand at least something. On the site, after all, only general information - they are! If it werenāt for the viewers of my stream, I wouldnāt have figured out many game situations on your server at all. And now I donāt even know what to tell the newcomers, because the main tasty function is starting to be tied to the hard work every season, and not just to rest in the game from lifeās difficulties.
Multiple OCD :
Forgot this one, people shouldnāt easily have access to tons of differents OCD.
I realize itās super super annoying to detect/correct, could make mistakes and ban stuff that shouldnāt (family) etc => Definitely not worth the invest.
Just saying, that itās also a problem increasing the critical mass xD
I once thought about having an extra OCD with cross warp. Iām just too lazy + realized I already have enough to stay lazy and have some PvP extra fun.
I donāt know what people are going to achieve witht he 40 stacks of 120k Erestrum, but itās mostly useless, theyāll never sell this much, or a 1 credit each, or over a time period of several seasons. I really donāt think we should care much about it (just an exemple)
i know itās rough sifting through walls of text and banter to see the depths of the conversation. quick summary for TLDR:
Rex is looking for a way to avoid past problems from constantly resurfacing.
he wants an automatic checking system to determine activity of players because there isnāt much to be gained by holding on to things for those who will never return.
a specific mission (even a super simple one) is seen as being forced to something unwanted. so now we are determining what should be considered active other than a list of chores.
mainly this has been met with those who can only see from their own perspective and do not understand why this is being discussed.
key things to understand here:
- this is all open for discussion, not set in stone.
- this is not a complete wipe of our stockpiles just portions depending on length of inactivity.
- there will be a grace period before the decay starts.
this discussion is for ideas on how to make this universe stay alive. nothing more, nothing lessā¦
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Damn all this politics 
Agree all the way with @Bob here, and that was also intended in my first post in this thread (very first post) I agree with what rexx wants to do, i just don`t agree about the way he do it. That was what i hoped more people wanted to discuse. It started well with some suggestions, and then it all went sidways to āi paid for itā and i collected for years"
IF it helps, i think i was one of the first patreons at this server. I have also been here since the start. I DO see the inflation going on, i do see the need to reduce it somehow!
Back to topic:
Me my self usally do not have so much time in each season! depends on work! In the earlier days i could spend more time ingame when i was at work( as most know verry well), but with rising rank, comes more responsibility!
If i hit a season with two periods free, i can agree to most, hunting stars etc etcā¦ then i have 2 months i can spend ingame if i want! If a wipe hit the other way, i only have 3-4 weeks i can spend gaming in total! and i try and use as much of it as possible in empyrion (and most of that again, hws) But i don`t want to da all that everytime i am ingame only to keep my stuff!
And i think many also want to keep exploring etc etc with the time given!
My suggestion is that players must make an amount of RP to keep their ocd. There is more ways to do this. Maybe raise the elemental rp reward to 6K and make 6K the rp goal to keep 100% of ocd/oam?
please people, come with suggestions, not just reject something that should be done!
dQ
ps: really sry my typing today, almost died 2 hours ago 
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Iāll stop myself from quoting some stuff you keep pushing (your own version of āseeing from their own perspectiveā, yes, you do it too Bob)
So plain and simple, what players expect to stay active :
- Fun, cool stuff to do, itās a GAME. With challenge sometimes, of course, but a game. and space is big, freedom is important.
- Most important for returners : NEW things to do. Which can come Eleon, from Vermillion/Ravien_ff, from Rexx/Admins, or even sometimes from players (JVI trying events for casual PvP, stuff like that).
- Leniency :
everyone can and will get tired at some point. Iāve done more than 15 years of WoW (which was often renewing content, too), years of League, years of Empyrion. But never 100% all the time. Life happens. OCD means happy come back to test out new stuff.
Quake events and such are a good idea. Iām not using them much myself, but some people like it, and itās yet something new to do.
I would recommend the same kind of events, but with Ships instead, people could safely discover PvP there.
Events with like, a HV race, with a theme (Star wars, old cars, mario kart, anything) .
Yes, once again, they all take time to plan and organize. But itās doable and Iāve seen it around the world already too.
How to consider someone active :
- Why not simply care about hours played ? It already exists, itās easily manageable and seen on the player dashboard, and shows more commitment than half a day traveling the galaxy.
- Seasons skipped : no more than 2 ? Thatās quite a break. Some people will say 4, but I would say itās not the best compromise for all.
- Money invested : If we also care about cash commitment, the patron/HWS buy could ponder the other criterias, or give you an extra time/season (I donāt mean a new 15ā¬ to keep stuff. I mean if you already spend regularly for stuff, it could trigger some rewards to protect you longer here)
I would avoid discord/forum usage (again, no reason to force anyone who doesnāt want. Penalties hardly trigger wanting to go there happily after)
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I want to add to what I said above how I see this decision from the outside: if you do not become the patron of the META level and do not fulfill my requirements / conditions, I will deprive you of the time spent in the game, erasing your reserves ā¦ Something to me is looks like extortion. How many projects have already ceased to exist because of such decisions ā¦
My suggestion:
We experienced wipe after versions of the game more than once, wipe after updating the mod too.
For that matter, even if I lose 4-5 seasons of my wasted time, do Armageddon OCD? Reset everything and everything?
It seems to me that if a player is active and understands the process of accumulating resources, reputation, etc., it will not be difficult for him to get back on his feet (sorry for the time spent - but this is a good investment in experience). This will solve a lot of problems with inactive players, although this is already an ultra solution.
u are correct in thisā¦ partially. I can empathize with new players because I was there at one time myself. I also have the experience of helping hundreds of new players learn the game. I have the ability to put myself in someone elseās shoes to see multiple points of view. Thatās how Iāve come up with my own. All Iām trying to do is open other peopleās eyes to see the rest of the picture. Yes I can be a jerk at times but I only give what I get in return. I will not sugar coat things or step on eggshells to keep from hurting someoneās feelings. facts are facts, as brutally painful as they areā¦
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hereās the thing, activity can have many definitions to different people.
how about everyone list what they do in the game that they consider to be āactiveā
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THAT would be amazing
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Ahah. Facts are facts, but I donāt see any painful one. Quants are the cheapest theyāve been in 6 months, other end game stuff are either stable or going down. People hoarded in the past, and are still hoarding new stuff, which will become the same worthless. I still donāt see any fact, currently, that requires what the admin team is suggesting.
Iām totally fine with defining active/inactive, or a reasonnable time after what, you seem to have really disappeared/stopped supporting the server, and do something.
But the way itās both presented, as well as the (possibly temporary) solution to it, are awfully wrong
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fact 1: HWS is a one man show that relies on honest feedback from the rest of us about our experiences.
fact 2: many HWS haters exist and constantly try to tear it down.
fact 3: there are OCD stockpiles that would ruin the economy for everyone.
like I said, when you have a limited point of view itās hard to see the rest of the picture. empy is far from a AAA game. HWS does not have the resources of major gaming communities out there. he is finally removing the curtains of what goes on behind the scenes.
itās not pretty to watch it being made, but we do enjoy baconā¦
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Alright, final message, short because long are not read anyway.
Have a problem with this => stop the half-assed annoying solutions. Either choose to delete after X seasons, or āforceā OCDs to fit to current numbers / set a max (not by stack, TOTAL, definitely)
Have a problem with activity => bring MORE, not LESS. Works like a charm.
Now do what you want
on hws+NA my ocd9 is ONLY GOLDā¦ so yes, i can fu** up the marked