Solid video, thanks. Should help devs track down what in their supposed fix to make underwater turrets not fire(back in v4) did not stick. If I had to hazard a guess I would say its tile rendering on the part of the turret, but hard to tell.
Technically underwater bases arent against the rules, nor are turrets. Because they arent supposed to be able to shoot lol.
I would consider that the underwater turrets are against the rules. I interpret this part of the turret rules as being violated by a turret being underwater, therefore not visible - quote from the rules:-
Turrets must be FULLY VISIBLE from the BASE UP. (bases may be partially buried provided clipping rule is not violated)
Plainly, the rule about turret visibility is being violated under these circumstances, therefore turrets shooting from underwater into the air are illegal because they are not visible to the person being shot at. Generally these turrets are not visible under the water either, also violating the visibility rule for turrets. This means that technically underwater turrets are against the rules. The fact that the base I saw has a fake faction name (dya) is further evidence that the people responsible know that they are breaking the rules.
I also have video of a base on Homeworld which is doing the same as Sacredglade posted. When I have cut the clip out I shall post it (probably tomorrow now). The base that shot at me was not the same one that shot at Sacredglade. I am of the opinion that there are several of these base types on Homeworld. Video Clip - https://youtu.be/OVg6Ff1QvM0
It happens i belive if the ground under the water is dug, thus creating an air bubble where your can place something that is firing, without being hindered by the water.
This thing should be against the rules, as you can’t even fire back, as water protects from most forms of fire. Only way to get to those turrets is to dig under the water and fire from this position.
Thanks Fulgrim - that explanation of the construction method makes perfect sense to me - appreciated.
I would agree with you that this should be an illegal act as it is clearly an exploit of the game mechanics. Like SV’s are not allowed to fire guns from behind solid blocks, same must be classed as when firing behind (below) water.
Thanks McProuty, I 100% agree that there is nothing wrong with underwater bases at all (in fact I actually hope the game devs develop the underwater aspect of the game further - sub aquatic vessels etc). I think you and Aeon are both right that it is the Base Turrets firing through water that is the issue to be addressed (ether by dev or the HWS community rules or both).
Yes I could imagine underwater placed turrets that are surrounded by base blocks, that do not fire out and through water. Very useful for legitimate defence from internal breach defence or defence from tunnel attack. So I totally agree that it is only placement that causes turrets to fire through water, that is wrong, not every placement of turrets.
I am quite happy with the legality of turrets protecting an underwater base as long as they do not fire outside the confines of the base. Any turret that does must be considered hidden and therefore against the rules. I have, in the past, been killed by base guns shooting through water, both when I was underwater and when I was in the air. Under both circumstances the turrets cannot be seen and therefore violate the hidden turret rule I quoted earlier.
I removed the underwater base on EU yesterday with @Mattcore37k… We used a 900 block HV and YOLO’D into the base tunnel. We managed to artillery a couple turrets but me being impatient and being the driver… I said F it and did a Leroy! We rushed into the turrets and hid behind a dead HV of theirs. We managed to hide behind this dead tank of theirs and snipe the rest of the turrets/core the base. We were hopping we’d get some magical mermaids that were super hot and wanted to party but all we found was crap ore and base ammo!
@aeonbug OMG just watched that video, that’s the base I rekt and the guy logged in while I was looting… Went to kill him and he combat logged. I left a HV there for him so I’m sure it’s done smoked him by now. Just wanted to say, yalls accents are freaking awesome. Sounds creepy I’m sure but it’s awesome.
Rexxus - copied the following from a forum post you made (Oct '16):
"Rexxxus from Oct '16: “I didn’t know that thrusters are deactivated if you enter the water now… that is not cool at all. So since Bases are in general OP now and in combination that the LOD / distance to the base is very short we now also disallow underwater turrets. Sad but as long as there is no way against that this is the state of the game right now”(edited)
“I adjusted it on HWS Guide Slide 6. BA / HV turrets are not allowed!”
The base in question DID NOT have underwater turrets. It was placed below the water in between
the non destructible layers. The buildable layer between these two indestructible layers was very thin.
The result was a few of the base’s turret barrels would extend into the terrain allowing them to clip
shot. It didn’t appear to me that this was intentional as it only occurred in a few turrets, no where near
enough to sway the outcome of the our assault. The majority of those turrets stopped firing through the
water and ground once rendered.
Thanks for the clarity MC. If I understand correctly - it was still an against the rules setup, and should have been corrected, or admin destroyed.
What more proof could we have provided to prompt an admin investigation and attention to this problem?
From the player involved perspective - if he/she at all pays attention to the forums - would they have not seen this post - and if an honorable player have already fixed the problem? Perhaps they did read this, but the lack of consequences led them to not care to fix it.
Rexxxus - this thing with turrets is become a rather frustrating and pervasive problem. Many have wondered why pvp is lacking and why pve playfields core count is full and running over. This is one of the reasons. Level the playing field and more will be willing to pvp.
@SwissSteel1 It’s a game bug… It’s not the building problems. I promise lol, I can show you sometime if you want. It’s hard to explain without knowing all the details but I can show you easily and show you what I mean… It happens for a few seconds and then stops when you get close enough and render everything. It’s not the people doing it intentionally I don’t think. Admins can do something more important than this… Players can kill the bases easily. I killed it with Matt in a very cheap HV we spawned cuz we were bored. It’s giving you something to do, something that is harder to offline raid. XD Took us like 10-15 minutes to kill the whole base. HV’s having auto turrets and having 2 pilots is easy! 2 different people in HWS, first instinct is to go tell admins, and first instinct is to kill it - Famous words from Matt
Thanks for the offer. Matt stated some of the turrets could extend and clip through the terrain. So - if I understand the rules, this still made it a violation.
Stripping all the details away - there remained turrets that from a players perspective were shooting up and through water for whatever reason, and they therefore were hidden and could not be seen and could not be directly countered.
That alone should have caused this to be addressed.
If you crawl in the past you find other rules also allowed… even Blueprint Class 7? Offline Protection?
After the October, around early 2017 or so they fixed, that these turrets can shoot outside of water. That is why we allowed water turrets again.
Devs also found the so called render gap. THIS is the biggest issue conncted with almost everything players are complaining about PvP on planets. If this is fixed, happy days!
Then underwater bases are for now the strongest bases since no sharks or whatever can take it down. Only with drilling to it somewhere, somehow.
However since the intention of Waterworld is mainly the cool POIs from Achilles with 6.X.X we disallow bases completely on that planet.